I have suggested a couple of times that the story of California dairy farmer Sharon Palmer—arrested, handcuffed in front of her children, and jailed overnight nearly a month ago– isn’t as neat and tidy as we might like.
She’s come under highly questionable criticism in comments on this blog, with links to court cases and old news articles, designed to suggest she has a dishonorable past and has been dishonest in her recent business dealings. One editor of a local paper emailed me after reading my post about Sharon, wondering cynically what she was doing with two Mexicans in the trunk of her car, which was mentioned in a ten-year-old clipping about a court case involving her. You’ll find the surprising answer to that and other matters in Sharon’s comment, following my initial Jan. 8 posting about this case (and re-published at the end of this posting).
I should note that I’ve been frustrated in trying to understand Sharon’s problems, since she’s been difficult to contact. I understand she’s had some power problems on her farm and, presumably, she’s been preoccupied with the pending legal case against her initiated by the Ventura County Sheriff, now under consideration by the county’s district attorney (discussed in my recent posts about this case).
As she suggests, though, the real issue is about the government’s approach to her farming activities. And here, the government has taken drastic action against her in connection with two matters: the licensing status of her facilities and the availability of raw goat’s milk to herdshare owners. We know that in other cases involving facilities licensing with large corporations, the authorities have been quite forgiving–never handcuffing any corporate officials, or even assessing penalties. And in the matter of herdshares, California has also been known to be tolerant—other herdshares have been out there, with knowledge by California Department of Food and Agriculture—operating without interference.
It seems clear that Sharon has been gaining her farming experience on the go, and in a less-than-hospitable community environment, but that doesn’t justify unequal application of the law.
***
Here’s the text of Sharon’s statement:
Hello All…I am here to explain about several comments made about me. This explanation is for those who have a common goal in our lifetime…Health,Family and Happiness. I am Sharon Palmer, the farmer. In 1998, a mortgage company owned by my spouse and his family fell into legal and financial troubles. It left me homeless with three babies.
My father, who was a sport fisherman, had a small cabin in Rosarito, Mexico. At that time, there were no legal problems involving me,I took my children and lived modestly while trying to rebuild my life. I worked with 2 churches that helped sick and homeless moms and children. I befriended a family that had illness in their family and needed to get medical help. I did drive family members to the U.S., but I was not charged because the authorities knew of the church and the circumstances.I have no regrets in helping this family.
This incident, however, resulted in my arrest for my husband’s mortgage company problems. They could not find him, so the authorities held me for 9 months in county jail, without a court hearing, until they found him. I was not an owner of this company, not on the bank accounts, not on the corporation, and never met the victims.
I settled for time served to be reunited with my children, which resulted in a felony. I didn’t have to pay restitution to victims–common in fraud cases–because my husband ran the business. He served 5 years.
The loss of my family and resulting helplessness convinced me to join with my oldest daughter and my mother to develop a more natural and pure business…Farming. My Mom and daughter purchased a farm in Fillmore.
The day we moved our entire family in, we realized there was no water on the farm. Having no farm experience, we were unaware of the necessity for well tests,and we took the real estate broker’s word that everything was okay. The broker and associates saw us coming–three women with no farm experience and not familiar with the area. We lost the farm and my daughter and mom have a lawsuit against them. This is where “Joe Slow” and the badmouthing come in.
To the person who states I owe them $1,400, please call me…if I made a mistake in billing or failed to pay someone, I am sorry.
I believe in what I do. I will continue to support my community with healthy foods and always try to do my best. These negative comments about my past issues have truly saddened me because the real issue is about our controlling government and poor commercial food choices. Small family farms need the public’s support. I am sorry you had to endure the negative unrelated issues.
i can’t imagine who i’d be today without those experiences, but i’m a child of the 60’s and 70’s and life and cops were different then, if we got caught in the park drinking beer or smoking we’d lose our stash to the cops and maybe be disbanded and sent home. no record, no juvi-hall…. hardly a slap on the wrist most times.
anyway if i were a kid today i’d most surely have a record for some violation of some "zero tollerence" policy.
i guess my point is that people need to be able to gain experience, learn what life is about, touch the edge of the envelope and maybe even push on it a bit, but today you really can’t and if you do, and you get "caught" you can end up crippling your entire life.
not that this is exactly sharon’s situation, but her story reminded me of todays life in general and i think it’s profoundly important to consider the implications of no one ever being able to start over.
thank god i grew-up when i did, and how i did,
someday i think this "basic human right" will come home to roost along with so many other un-american policies our country has drafted.
who’s running this show anyway? i don’t think it’s we the people…
Hugh Betcha,
It is a different world than when we grew up. If you discipline your kids a way in that someone doesn’t agree with; you may go to jail, have the kid taken away, etc. Many are not accountable for thier actions (kids and adults).
Who is running the show? History will repeat itself. Look how Hitler came into power. I think people want to believe in something positive, especially when they are down. We need hope. Unfortunately many appear to have hope that someone can help or fix the problems. When did it go from being self-sufficient to depending on someone else? 125 yrs ago you relied on yourself and family, not the govt or any other entity. Why do people rely on them now? (I do believe that America should be self-sufficient to include food, energy, etc.)
David,
You are very right, "the unequal application of the law" shown to the small farmer is not justified. Apparently it is quite wide-spread.
Let’s just say that she purchased items from me then sold the items at the farmer’s market and never paid me for them. Every time I contacted her she had one excuse after another and swore she would never do this to me and that she would pay me. But then I would never hear from her. As the editor has experienced, she is nearly impossible to get a hold of.
I consider myself a reasonable person. I have tried everything in my power to resolve the matter, I have written her a letter and have left messages weekly on her phone. But yet she still continues to blow me off. This has been going on for nearly a year now.
So Sharon, if you are reading this, I would appreciate your paying me for the items you purchased and resold at your markets – $1390 to be exact. I am pretty darn certain you know who I am, but in case you don’t my name is Sandy.
As for everyone else on this blog – please, please, please be careful of the people from which you buy your products. Demand proof that their product is what they say it is.
Thank you for sharing.
At the farmers markets that I use here in Sacramento, the farmers sell directly to the public. They are there to answer questions. As far as I can tell there aren’t any 3rd party sellers.
http://www.california-grown.com/
When those of us who have lived in what America once was and we mention police state we are seeing that from a far different view and background than the younger folks. You might want to consider what we are saying before its to late,
It’s beginning to seem like it is already too late.
I keep wondering why the vendetta against small, sustainable farmers and healthy food. We read more each day about the efforts, largely propelled by those with connections to Monsanto, to prevent access to food that is not under their patents. We read last year about the doomsday vault, for the preservation of heirloom seed stocks. Why would the Rockefellers and Bill Gates put up money for this vault, meanwhile doing nothing to stop the destruction of food germ plasm by trans-genic stray pollen? There must be a horrendous plan, as Henry Kissinger famously hinted, to control all food, with the purpose of controlling the human population. Why else would a few small farmers be a threat? Given that those in power are well aware of peak oil and population overshoot, and have already foreseen the unavoidable dieoff that is already underway in Africa (Zimbabwe, Congo), I would think that we sustainable growers might be safely ignored, and left to become the seed stock for the new human survival paradigm, as the repositories of knowledge, skills and stock (can’t store calves and chickens in Svaalbard) for restoring human civilization after the oil is gone.
But that doesn’t seem to be in their plan. I can’t escape concluding that ‘they’ really have a very nefarious plan of total dominance and control of humanity.
As for peace officers and prisons. One way to cull the herd is to taint people in some way and bring them under control of the state. Prisoners in this country are already used as near-slave labor by corporations. My guess is that plantation mentality is still alive and well. This week’s article about the military warning of the potential for the sudden collapse of Mexico is chilling, in light of rumored plans for a ‘North American Union.’ One wonders if the economic crisis was intentionally planned in order to cause the collapse of the US as well, meanwhile ‘they’ make off with our patrimony (since we won’t be needing it, they must think).
Things are moving so rapidly, and the Obama appointments are largely from the same mold as the prior regime; the ‘bailout’ funds are disappearing into a black hole of no accountability, meanwhile people are still being foreclosed, to what useful purpose, if one believes in the common welfare of the people?
Bottom line for me: The only way to make sense of the attacks on independent food producers is as part of an overall plan of corporate/government totalitarian control of the population to some end that has nothing to do with what we’ve known as the USA and her Constitution.
Whenever a ‘Joe Slow’ attempts to smear someone via innuendo and association, it behooves us to find out the facts underneath. Why would a scam artist want to try to make an honest living, or even a dishonest living as a farmer? These days.
or is he? somehow i doubt it from what i’ve seen so far. what i think might be interesting is how his fans react once reality sets in…
plus i think there is a real posibility that obama might "have to" declare marshall law on us.
i believe it’s too late also. anymore i’m just thinking lets get it overwith already, i want to create something sustainable for my family, while i’m working hard at it today the looming collapse of our society will likely take it away from me. then i’ll have to 1. survive and 2. start over. what a pain in the a**.
when has our gov’t ever done something economicly positive. ahh! fdr’s new deal! ummm, well no that didn’t actually work, in 39 we were about as bad off as we were in 33. the war helped i guess…
currently i believe most people are simply unable to grasp what it might mean should real belt tightening be required. america is balanced on top of a system that when examined resembles the tower built by dr susses grinch who stole cristmas so he could pluck the star off the towns tree.
what trigger event could (will) occur. a pretty large volcano and a year without a summer? a failure of the electric grid for a few weeks? a nuke in iran, india, isreal? maybe in a big port city here in the good ole us of a?
how about that collapse of mexico, maybe 10’s of thousands of poor slobs racing for the us boarder and being gunned down by our new homeland security defense (and marshall law trained) northern command?
the more one reads about our current path toward fasism the more it becomes harder to not see it everywhere. even small town america has para-military police forces and regional swat teams.
it’s a good question to ask…. what is really going on here?
the fda and ftc are clamping down on natural supplements and alternate health care like hitler did to jews in 38-39. make life hard for them, disparage them and their livelyhoods, print debasing stories about them, sway people to shun them to dispise them… then (for the good of the whole…). remove them.
small, sustainable farming is alternate medicine today, we’re a fringe group… how sad for humanity.
i sometimes wonder, if california can run happy cow ads nationwide when there are really very few happy cows in that state, sans a few (local market only) real milk dairies. and they are exempt from being sued to stop lieing in ads. why doesn’t someone with big money run ads spelling out the truth to the people?
i think mostly it’s because there are way, way, way too many people. to the power in america (and the world it seems) we are "useless eaters" depleting "their" resourses and for the most part, though for their own peace of mind never spoken aloud. we need to be gotten rid of.
how else can you explain soy beans being sold as a food staple?
how else can you explain hundreds of other destructive "policies" that are now the norm. all the cries of "it’s for the children" have dulled my compassion to a blunt end. no child left behind comes to mind. should be rephrased as no child left unscarred, or no child allowed to excel.
zero tolerance is not compatible with human nature….
the list is long….
good luck to all of us who are aware, and be/get prepared.
http://fanaticcook.blogspot.com/2009/01/fda-will-not-be-requiring-labels-on.html
Here is a positive story about raw milk with a picture of our friend Mark Mcafee who has regrettably been silenced from posting here. Maybe he wasnt ordered directly by the courts to shut up but perhaps it was legally prudent to do so. Nevertheless the result is the same. Welcome to the no longer land of freedom of speech and liberty and JUSTICE for all. OUTRAGEOUS IS IT NOT?
"Telford Taylor, the US Chief Prosecutor at the Nuremberg War Crimes Tribunal against the directors of the oil and drug Cartel IG Farben predicted that if the corporate culprits behind WWII are not brought to the daylight, they will do more harm in future generations then the Nazis ever could.
This time has come now.
In this situation the knowledge of history becomes the most powerful strategic tool to overcome any obstacle, as insurmountable as it may appear.
The stakeholders of the cartel who no doubt will read this website too will need to understand that if they proceed with their unscrupulous plan for a global coup and a global economic government this information will spread like a bush fire. With every step they take to impede the movement of change, the cartel is moved two steps closer to its own demise. "
Here is a link to the history:
http://www.no-coup.org/history.html
Here is the link to the homepage of this site. Each box will bring you to a tab with further information.
http://www.no-coup.org/index.html
The documentation of the accusations about IG Farben, the trial transcripts, have been made available on line at the Profit Over Life website.
http://www.profit-over-life.org/books/books.php?book=30
The first time I read through Dr. Rath’s no-coup site, it sounded like "conspiracy theory" to me. As I’ve delved deeper, it seems too much to be coincidence. The over zealous nature of the attacks against small farmers fits right in with the strategies for a global ecomony controlled by oil and pharma interests. Exposure of this group and their intents is seen as the best way to stop them.
Thank you for the insightful blog David.
If I or any other raw milk provider had sickened hundreds of people and killed six, we would be thrown into jail and tried for murder. We would be broken and then destroyed to be SURE we would never harm anyone EVER AGAIN.
Here, six dead people are merely…. an unfortunate situation:
"The actions we are taking today are in keeping with our more than 100-year commitment to providing consumers with safe, high-quality products," said David Mackay, Kellogg’s president and CEO. "We apologize for this unfortunate situation." http://apnews.excite.com/article/20090117/D95OS2T80.html
Do you think WE would be allowed to just "apologize for this unfortunate situation"???
I’m inclining with Suzanna, et al….
Well, that depends on where you look. There are many discussions going on about the peanut butter outbreak. A past participant here has urged more action from FDA:
At least thirty companies purchased peanut butter or paste from a facility with a documented link to a nation-wide Salmonella outbreak, said Marler. The FDA has the authority actually, the mandate to request recalls if the public health is threatened. Instead, the FDA has asked the companies to test their products and consider voluntary recalls. It is just not enough.
http://tinyurl.com/78gaal
Personally, I’ve found the last several series of comments to be relatively hostile toward participants with different opinions than the majority. And, some questions about Steve Bemis’ suggestions to improve the legal situation with raw milk were ignored. There seems to be more interest in coming up with names for regulators like Jihad and PhD nazi…rather than a desire to discuss realistic approaches to solve some of the potentially solvable conflicts. Just an observation…
Many of he advisors chosen by our new president do not currently inspire confidence that there will be a significant change. At least not initially. I prefer to keep a positive frame of mind though – take action where needed and think positively. Exposing the truth and identifying the real culprits makes it harder for them to operate.
If the Codex is enforced in the US, nutritional supplements will no longer be available in functional concentrations.
Scenario 1 possibly is that this will force everyone to get their needed nutrition from their food. Our depleted and deficient food supply will rapidly become apparent. The demand for real foods with real nutrition will increase, and our soils and pastures will start to heal. Will there be more pain and ugliness before the beauty? Probably. There most likely be a great deal of civil unrest and civil disobedience at some point too.
Scenario 2 might be a larger scale awareness of real food and traditional ways of preparing food. As people discover the difference it makes, it brings increased support for the farmers who produce this nutritious food and allows for better foods and better quality supplements for those want them.
If we plant a seed and then ignore the field, we cannot complain about a lack of harvest. If we plant a seed and then nurture it along and protect it, we will have sustenance.
The same is true if we want democracy and benign (preferably benevolent) leadership.
The seeds of awareness have been planted. We need to diligently protect and nurture these seeds by raising awareness among all with whom we have contact. Otherwise the humans race is also doomed.
this is of course only my observation.
"Personally, I’ve found the last several series of comments to be relatively hostile toward participants with different opinions than the majority. And, some questions about Steve Bemis’ suggestions to improve the legal situation with raw milk were ignored. There seems to be more interest in coming up with names for regulators like Jihad and PhD nazi…rather than a desire to discuss realistic approaches to solve some of the potentially solvable conflicts. Just an observation… "
This is how they act when you hit too close to home. I enjoy your comments and attempts at open communication on the topic. Thanks for putting up with the abuse they sometimes dish out on this blog.
cp
i asked you several times and will once more. what about the 250,000 children with crohn’s? clearly linked with pasturized milk from factory "farms" you insist you’re interested in being the voice for the children at risk from real milk, what is that number over the last decade? how many of those died? oh wait, none died. your "concern" that brings you here is misplaced big time, most on this blog might shine you guys on, you’re not worth the time. but when you both continuously spout misrepresented information ad-nausium you’re not tricking anyone into believing your dogma.
abuse? grow-up, look in the mirror. you need a reality check.
i imagine you are both silly little cogs in a big machine turning a deadend driveline engaged only to dump spent oil, but in your minds you’re the most important big wheel on the block.
take a poll and ask who wants your cut and paste comments here, you clearly have no intention of actually learning anything, since in the time you’ve been here you haven’t adapted a bit. what do you want here? why can you not be honest with the group and fess up?
do you know the term "troll" from your contributions here it’s clear that that’s what you are. good luck to you both, you’ll eventually need it…
if you ask me, and even if you wouldn’t, i’ll tell you
Your negative comments are right on target as an illustration of the recent theme here about the challenges that occur when persons from different cultures and belief systems try to communicate. Thanks.
Thank you for being the obvious example of the problem. Martin Luther King Jr. is the example you need to follow. You also need to work at not being threatened so easily. It brings out an ugly side of you.
cp
"you’re in the same catagory"
What category would that be? And, a philosophical question (not raw milk related, just general), which categories of people should be excluded from this conversation?
I completely agree with you about these trolls.
Remember nothing infuriates a troll more than ignoring them.
If you ignore them they go away.
Observer, CP, et al, I asked three questions, and none were answered. Let me repost them:
1) Where are the handcuffs and arrests for Kellogg officials in this last salmonella outbreak that’s sickened hundreds in 43 states and killed at least six people??
2) Why aren’t the ones on this list who’ve been so vocal here against raw milk, now and just as loudly, agitating to string up the CEOs responsible for all those sickened and dead people?? Not a peep from them…
To clarify, I did not ask for discussion on OTHER lists… just THIS one. Reread question 2. I’ll restate the question: Where is the outrage, HERE, on THIS list, against deadly peanut butter and where is the concern for those sick/dead people (children as well as adults, some undoubtedly immune-compromised), by those who have been so anti-raw milk all these months? Unless it isn’t the sick and dead people you really care about, but rather, raw milk destruction….?
3) If I or any other raw milk provider had sickened hundreds of people and killed six, we would be thrown into jail and tried for murder. You know this as well I do. Do you think WE would be allowed to just apologize for this "unfortunate situation"?
Additional questions:
4) Do YOU agree that the peanut butter salmonella deaths and illnesses are "an unfortunate situation"??
5) If you don’t agree, then why aren’t you calling for those responsible to be handcuffed and thrown into jail?
6) If you do agree, then why single raw milk providers???
These are excellent questions. An outbreak has occurred. People are sick and a few have even died. Information is in the news about it. A recall has occurred. People are being told not to eat peanut butter. This is a large scale outbreak because this peanut butter is sold throughout the country. This is a second Salmonella outbreak for peanut butter in a short period of time. Peanut butter will probably be placed on the list as a high risk food for Salmonella.
Is this outbreak being treated different from a raw milk outbreak? No. Were farmers handcuffed, arrested and jailed in any of the raw milk outbreaks that have occurred over the last few years? No. So there wouldnt be an arrest in these cases either.
We dont put people in jail for killing someone because they ingested a foodborne pathogen. Its not considered murder. Thats why there are civil law suits. Im sure people who have become ill in this outbreak will contact an attorney and sue for damages. Thats the way our system of democracy is set up.
Do I feel compassion for the people who became ill? Yes. Is it horrible? Yes. Should pathogens be in our food supply? No
For anyone interested, here are intimate stories of the damage that can be done from a foodborne pathogen: http://www.safetables.org/victim_wall/index.cfm
I will answer your questions:
1. Answered it above
2. Ive never advocated stringing up a farmer after a raw milk about break. I also answered the question above. Civil court addresses the needs of the victims. The victims have every right to access this aspect of the legal system
3. In a state where raw milk is legal to sell, this has not happened. Im not sure what would happen to a farmer selling it in a state where it is not legal to do so. If we ever do prosecute for murder, I hope the first group to suffer this consequence will be the CEOs of beef companies.
4. Yes
5. I do agree. For those that became ill, it is terrible.
6. Is peanut butter being promoted as a health food that boosts ones immune system and can cure a person from everything that ails them? No. Is the peanut butter industry encouraging people to feed their infants peanut butter? No. See the difference.
When a raw milk outbreak occurs, who is the only group that seems to deny it?
cp
hard to resist being a troll ain’t it cp?
let me spell it out again for you (not that it hasn’t been spelled out for YOU directly many times on this blog) and that’s why you are a troll.)
when a pathogen is identified and found in or directly linked to a raw dairy no one here denies it. open your little pea brain and understand though that when there is no evidence and when say 360 samples of chicken test positive for said pathogen but no tests find any in real milk or on the suspected dairy and the regulators ignore the chicken and blame the milk… that’s when we cry foul.
but i realize explaining this to you yet again is a waste of time because you’re a troll, and really not a very good one at that… way too transparent, you weren’t trained very well, but not to feel bad cp, it takes years to become a professional troll so if you like the assignment keep at it, over time you’ll get better at it.
i’d point you to web sites that instruct in the art of being a troll, but heck, it’s not my job to enable you. it’s my job to point you out to others who also might be newer to the webs politics and actually think you’re sincere.
you don’t have a sincere bone in your body on this issue, which is sad, while i doubt you’re really a "health" teacher, i don’t doubtt you work in health…. likely for the fda or usda. i can conclude this because a true health teacher of children wouldn’t let themselves be minipulated the way you have let happen to yourself.
a true teacher would be open minded and fair handed…. i will concede that it’s possible you’re really a school teacher of health, but just a really bad one, in which case you need to consider resigning before you do more damage to our youths ability to research and learn and think on their own.
of course you’ll protest that this is an "attack" on you, it’s not… it’s the result of many years experience out here in cyberspace reading, learning, evaluating, observing, participating and understanding how it works. i’m someone telling you the truth in a matter of fact, blunt fashion, i’ve no time for your games and attempts to distort the truth to fit your bosses agenda. and i’m insistant that you are restricted to doing as little damage out here as i can counter.
there are two sides to everything, just consider me as not on yours. i’ (and most people here) are on the side of fair and balanced. you are on the side of dogma, propaganda, fear mongering, and control of others.
it’s really that simple and that straight forward. sorry if this is too blunt for you or some readers, i’m just way past the point of playing word games and playing nice nice with trolls… all trolls have an agenda while most posters simply have an opinion. the difference might be suttle to you and some newer to the web, but it’s important to learn how to tell the two apart. in that way maybe you can call me a teacher too.
Even though you are a verbal bully and I dont like interacting with bullies, I will answer your question about Crohns disease because it is an important one.
The SAD American diet along with environmental toxins damages the immune system. The majority of our immune system is housed in the digestive track. Once this track is damaged, something called leaky gut can happen. Undigested proteins enter the blood stream and trigger an allergy reaction in the body. After this occurs, its a domino downward spiral in health.
I believe that drinking raw milk somehow addresses the damage of leaky gut. This is why there are so many healing testimonials after a person adds raw milk to their diet. Can a person heal leaky gut without drinking raw milk as the cureyes? It is not the only cure. If it was, I would make the statement that it may be worth the pathogen exposure to become healed. But since it is not, I dont believe it is worth the risk WITH CHILDREN. PATHOGENS KILL!
Having said that, Crohns disease is horrendous. A colleague I work with has it. Commercial milk is terrible stuff. The cows are sick. The milk is laden with pesticides, hormones and tons of dead bacteria. I would not recommend that anyone drink it. Contemporary processed milk is probably the reason so many people are now casein sensitivethey have an allergy to the milk protein.
I dont believe raw milk for children is the answer to our crappy, pasteurized store bought milk. If adults with developed immune systems want to drink it, more power to you. For the small farmer selling raw milk, I believe an ideal solution would be to teach people how to gently pasteurize their own milk. This way the person can decide which way they would like their family to consume the milk. I believe it is the best of both worlds. A family can purchase clean milk from healthy cows and then gently pasteurized it in the event there are pathogens. I believe this is the responsible way to sell raw milk to families with children.
People that frequent this blog are pro raw milk revolution. With this pro stance comes responsibility. The information about raw milk, both pros and cons, needs to be discussed and addressed rationally. Steve Bemis is attempting to do this. Thank you Steve for your great contribution to this blog.
hugh betcha, in the future, please stop with the bullying. It is ugly and unproductive. Im sure you are a better person than the way you speak on this blog. Many people read this blog. You hurt the raw milk movement by the way you verbally behave. You will not win people over or get people to change their minds with personal attacks. Your behavior is no different than calling a black person the N word. Kindness and friendliness goes a long way. Treat others as you would like to be treated. How did Martin Luther King Jr. behave? How did he treat others who disagreed with him? Please follow his example for change. Honey leaves a sweet taste in the minds of others, vinegar is sour.
crohns is bad you say, and real milk can offer a cure you admit. but again your agenda can’t be put aside because you are forced to equate a .012% risk of getting tainted raw milk against the horrors of crohns?
i’m sure you see your own conflicting reasoning, and since you can’t reason through it to the (more) correct solution you are compelled to fall back on the dogma of industrial medicine. big agra-business caused crohns via overly processed foods that offer no real health solution topped with big-dairy’s inability to cleanup their act in the face of needing higher and higher profits.
you seem reasonably intelligent so there can be no other conclusion (if you’ve done the unbias reading and research) that you are a paid mouthpiece of disinformation, dogma and fear mongering. how can one conclude anything else?
you preach about wanting only 100% safe solutions and target real milk with a cdc doucumented .012% risk vs. industrial "solutions with a cdc doucumented 25% risk. i say "get read cp" you say you are honest and balanced…. i say lookat hese facts. you say yes it’s horrid what industurial fod is doing to people. there are 250,000 children in the usa today with crohns. how many with proven real milk related hus?
what’s your cure for crohns anyway? the only well doucumented help fro crohns i’vee been able to find involves a complete rejection of factory food and a strict regimen of whole, mostly raw, nutrient dense real food. but you’re agenda forces you to whaffle here and insist on "gently pasturizing real milk?????
if you pasturize it you kill it. if it’s tainted odds are the bug will survive this gentle pasturizing (i find even writing that phrase difficult along the same lines i’d find it difficult to talk about being a little bit pregnent… how can you not seee that?
anyway, i’ll pause and consider other verbage when i "correct" your propaganda as not to "bully" you so much, but if you continue spouting the same party lines and ignoring the real issues of this topic i think i’ll continue being blunt and as much on target as my knowledge base and insistance on individual liberty to choose finds itself in direct conflict with your desire to tell others what they need to do to "save the children"
remember it’s documented as .012% vs. 25% risk of pathogens. remember it’s proven that real foods (mostly eaten raw) that promote health and healing after one has damaged their body with factory foods. you may want to argue pro-biotic pills again but remember also that nothing can nor ever will be 100% . well except death of course. which we’re gonna do… guaranteed 100%!
now ask yourself, do you wanta go out happy and healthy maybe at a ripe old age or do you want to get there (to deaths door) on factory foods with the proven relationship to cronic and over time more and more crippling degenertive diseases? while all along taking more and more "medicine" that suspresses the worst of the symptoms without curing anything at all. although i guess you might take some sollice in knowing you’re doing your part to participate in the corporate system and making american/world corporations healthy and strong.
Do you feel better now that you got that off of your chest? By the way, thank you for the complement that at least you think I’m reasonably intelligent. I will cling to the one nice thing you had to say. Its a baby step in the right direction.
Im not your enemy. Im your sister in the plight of finding good health for family and friends. Please treat me as you would treat your sister.
I wonder , if there was an opportunity to sit down and discuss your questions over a nice meal (you drinking raw milk, me drinking pasteurized milk), would you call me a troll , a pea brain, or some other degrading name?