If You Can't Say Something Nice About Me...What the Heck, Say It Anyway
Tuesday, April 1, 2008 at 10:20PM I guess I should feel honored. The barfblog, also known as “musings from the International Food Safety Network,” took notice of my article in the Boston Globe Sunday Magazine.
As you might imagine, Doug Powell, the author, wasn’t too pleased about the article, labeling it (under a heading “raw milk bs”) as “the advertisement masquerading as a story…”
So I wrote a comment on the blog, expecting to direct you to it. But barfblog apparently doesn’t believe in spontaneous comments, like on this blog--my comment needs to be reviewed first before it is published. So here’s what I said:
“I find your comments about me and about my article in the Boston Globe Sunday Magazine curious. You identify me as ‘an advocate for raw milk’--is that something like being 'a known communist sympathizer'? Many journalists today who report fairly on health and politics have blogs where they express their personal views. You identify yourself as "a journalist," yet you are anti-raw-milk for children. As an editor, I wouldn't consider that a reason not to allow you to write about the subject.
"You say I engaged in ‘statistical cherry picking throughout the story,’ yet you offer only a single example of 'comparing confirmed illnesses from raw dairy products to the overall estimated illnesses from food'--even though the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) insists on using the 76 million annual cases of food-borne illness as a fact, not an estimate, for the number of overall illnesses.
I know you couldn't find anything to dispute in terms of facts or research because, like a fighter who resorts to clinching when he's losing, you resort to emotions--the oldest emotional argument around this subject: it's for the sake of the kids.”
On the positive side, an outside commentator did have something nice to say about my Boston Globe article, as well as this blog (praising our “lively conversation"): a reporter at the Rutland Herald, writing about legislation in Vermont designed to liberalize regulations under which farmers can sell raw milk to farmers. It’s a well done article, covering a lot of ground, with some excellent examples. Worth reading.
Reader Comments (29)
"...grain feeding is a minor dietary component."
I am wondering if anyone can tell me, for a raw-milk dairy with Jersey cows, how much supplemental grain is too much grain?
I find farms on all ends of the grain-feeding spectrum, from none to all. I am wondering where to draw the line and how to measure the line (scoops per day, pounds per day, etc).
While there are those out there that are grass nazi's...and their tolerance for grain is ziltch, I think it more prudent to let the cow tell you a) if it needs additional inputs and b) how much it should get. The condition of your cow is paramount, and following some inflexible dogma regarding concentrates does not serve higher levels of health. It also depends on the time of season. Supplementing during the winter is different than giving grain 12 months a year. I think it more prudent to evaluate the farmers attitude towards (and selection of) concentrates rather than hinge on the number of grams they get.
Taking a cow that has been selected (for the last 60+ years) for performance on grain and throwing it out on pasture alone and expecting it to thrive, is not wise (or healthful). Thankfully there are those out there that are concentrating on grass based genetics (pun intended).
One percent of body weight per day....half a percent....there are those who have proposed rules. I prefer the anarchy of the free market system. If you know your farmer, and appreciate his attitude towards his cows and his agriculture, then there is no reason to tip a scale.
From the fact that almost no-one comments on his posting except us when he mentions raw milk, I don't think that very many people are interested in what he has to say.
Milkfarmer, Could you give me an example of how I would ask the question and what would be a desirable answer vs an undesirable one?
Also, is it true that a cow given unlimited access to both grass and grain, will chose the grain? I guess I make the assumption that cows are no better at chosing what is best for them than we are (given our national obsession with sugar/white flour).
I appreciate your help! We non-farmer consumers are often told to check out the farm and ask questions, but often don't have a clue as to what to look for or what to ask.
Taking the opportunity to inject some of my own personal opinion, I'd like to say that I rarely have strong opinions on controversial matters. I do my best to see both sides of a story and am even often willing to 'agree to disagree'. However, everything I've read about the raw milk issue leads me to believe that there is little to no controversey. It is almost literally a case of right versus wrong, as close to a black and white issue as we are likely ever to come in this world fraught with shades of grey.
I'm no conspiracy theorist, and frequently clutch tightly to a belief in my fellow man's inherent goodness and ability to see reason, but this? Perhaps I'm naieve, but I'm amazed at the lengths to which people go to delude themselves and how thoroughly they blind themselves to facts, preferring instead to rely on hysteria and fear.
I do have one question. From everything I've read the most conclusive thing I've found (without the benefit of personal experience) is that there needs to be more research. Most scientific studies I've found quote data that is decades old at the earliest. Am I right in assuming that more research must be done?
Aaaah I've rambled, but thank you again for this blog and all your links. I've long wanted to raise my own animals and what I've learned about raw milk has only strengthened that desire. If the sale of raw milk in Iowa is still illegal when my dreams are realised at least I'll have 'the good stuff' for myself and my family.
http://www.lancasterfarming.com/node/1165
There wasn't any mention in last week's Farm and Dairy, but that magazine comes out on Thursday and I may have missed the submission deadline. I'll check back tomorrow and see if they'll run it in this week's issue. At least Lancaster Farming has base of over fifty thousand subscribers, so that's a lot of people in the mid-West who are now aware of what is happening in California.
Concerning grain feeding, there are general rules of thumb (0.5% - 1.0% of the cow's weight, as noted above, which for an 800 lb animal would be 4-8 lbs a day), but this is complicated by the issues of individual animals, the amount of seed heads (grain) the animal is getting in pasturage, etc.etc. Tim devotes a page and a half to the issue.
Does the $6 public price for the "Raw Milk Production Handbook" apply to consumer-level FTCLDF members, or will we be receiving it automatically as well? It sounds like something that I'd like to read for my own edification.
First, the right...
Yes, there should be more studies, but those studies should, somehow, be unbiased toward either side. To date, all the "accepted" studies I have seen share two commonalities. They are anti-raw milk, and they are generally associated, either through funding (university grants from agribusiness) or through association (CDC) with confirmed anti-raw milk folks.
Agriculture is like any other business in that it runs on money, and the type of farmers that produce raw milk are not capable, financially, of funding studies that fit their agenda like the ConAgra's, ADM's, Perdue's, etc., so when those folks fund studies slanted their way, there is little to no competing scientific information.
Then, there is my contention that the legality of raw milk should not hinge on this or that study, biased or unbiased.
People should have the right to make their own choices regarding nutrition, whether those choices are healthy or not.
I would never advocate for banning highly processed deli meats, McDonald's Big Macs, or sushi. If folks wish to consume those foods, which are unhealthy in the extreme, THEY HAVE THAT RIGHT. All I ask is that other folks, that would choose differently, have the same right to choose for themselves.
I don't want to see government promoting or banning ANY nutritional choice. I just want them to stay out of our personal business and let us make our own choices.
Bob Hayles
Thornberry Village Homestead
Jasper, GA
Thornberry Village Homestead...owned by God, managed by Bob and Tyler.
Thanks for the heads up on the booklet. I know many people who will want a copy (myself included), and I plan to share the news with them.
A farmer must have a clear understanding of the grain issue if I were to trust them to make my food. They must recognize the internal changes that grain can make in the rumen, and its effect on digestion, gut flora, and absorption. I rather not buy from some dumb hick spouting out the party line ‘grain is bad’. Understanding the why shows more depth. (and this is what you want to find…someone who is REALLY into it).
Despite the drawbacks of concentrates, certain grassfarmers recognize it can have a place in their husbandry. A consumer must see how a farmer views the energy foods….a ‘crutch’, the last resort, a tool in their arsenal. Extrapolating from your farmer his attitudes makes better the piece of mind you get when you open your fridge. The most important question you can ask your farmer is……why?
Another thing one can find out is what kinds of grain are they using? Are they growing it themselves? Are they purchasing organically grown grains (and are you willing to pay more for them to do so)? Are they staying away from corn and other widely dispersed gmo crops (is there really any truly gmo free corn left in this world… …. …..the answer is blowing in the wind). What they are using can speak volumes.
Grain is easy for cattle, Elizabeth. A cow is set up to take in a tremendous volume of food to extract the energy it needs. They spend most of their day hungry, grazing till they’re full. Like most animals, including humans, they will take the shortcut… decisions of energy always demand it. It’s not a conscious thing. One should not fault an organism for wanting to ‘survive ultra-efficiently’. There is nothing a cow would rather do than lay around all day and put on fat….(sounds like a few humans we know…eh?)...beats walking around for hours collecting enough for a meal.
Hope this helps.
I have some anecdotal evidence to address some of your questions. First off, Extension agents use a figure of 3% of body weight to figure how much dry matter a milking cow consumes. Beef steers probably eat somewhat less since they aren't working as hard as the mothers that are making milk.
We feed grain to get the cows to come into the barn for milking. When the grass is lush, about a third of the cows don't touch the grain and seem to come in only to follow the herd. We've also had a cow get severe stomachache when I failed to shut the barn door behind them and she snuck back in and pigged out at the grain cart. So some cows prefer healthy green grass and others can overindulge in candy.
I'm not an expert on asking milk farmers questions but from talking to milk drinkers I've got some idea of what to ask.
-Ask what the farmer drinks. The answer will probably be "the best milk in the world, which is in my bulk tank". The best motivator for me to produce that best milk is that my family is going to be enjoying it.
-Ask why they are selling raw milk, kind of like when answering a classified ad I put some weight on the answer to the question why the item is for sale.
-One question we've asked of drinkers is why they drink raw milk. I wouldn't look askance at a farmer that didn't ask that question since part of the reason we ask comes from some paranoia about Ag&Mkts Confidential Investigators collecting evidence and hopefully not all milk farmers are so afflicted. However, before we knew about such Investigators, we'd ask out of curiousity and were and are told wonderful stories about the perceived benefits of real milk. And we get to know who's drinking our milk and who's supporting us and we begin building another friendship.
-Since grain can be used to increase milk production and since milk processors pay primarily for volume of milk or in other words feeding grain is economically advantageous as long as the increase in milk income exceeds grain cost, some questions about the farmer's goals for the farm and source of income are suggested. How to do that diplomatically is not easy.
Now that I've embarked on this line of questions, I realize that there is no simple question or a simple answer and I also realize that I can't answer any of these questions for other farmers and further realize that the answers don't necessarily correlate with clean milk. Perhaps there is no question but only a conversation that you and the farmer should begin and the correct answer will come when that conversation gets to the point that you both feel you can trust each other.
That is the key Steve and Elizabeth. Everyone has different motivations and production methods. No two farmers will be the same. It is this ability to have a conversation and interact on a human level that sets this new food system apart. It is so much better than relying on a jug label or a simplistic questionnaire. And the farmer benefits as much as the consumer in this type of relationship.
Regarding Steve's #1 suggestion - I have found people selling raw milk who don't drink it themselves. One family had children who would only drink it if chocolate syrup was added. Their milk had an off-taste, so I could understand why.
Some farmers are easier to question than others. Some get defensive, even when they have the best practices. Others are elusive. Plus, decision making (choosing which farmer to go with) gets complicated when you don't always have a large selection of raw-milk farmers to choose from. Hopefully that situation will continue to improve for everyone.
I am looking forward to reading the FTCLDF booklet.
Feeding grain increases milk production and until recent jumps in grain prices,feeding grain helped keep the costs per gallon down.
The most important question is how does feeding grain effect the community of bacteria in the cows digestive system.The ideal PH for the rumen bacteria to reproduce rapidly is 6.8 to 7.0. As the forage in the rumen ferments the PH falls. To keep the PH in the favorable range the cow chews it's cud,mixing many gallons of saliva(PH of 8) into the forage.Stemmy forage stimulates more cud chewing and so keeps the PH in the proper range.Feeding grain reduces cud chewing and so limits the addition of saliva to the rumen.Grain also ferments rapidly.As the PH of the rumen drops,The bacteria responsible for digesting the forage reproduce more slowly.Bacteria that are more tolerant of the acid conditions now have less competition for the nutrients and they can reproduce more rapidly.As the PH drops the community of bacteria in the rumen changes and favors the more acid tolerant bacteria.
The smell and consistency of the cow's manure is much different depending on how acid it is.Neutral (PH 7) manure smells sweet,acid manure smells sour.
The increased acidity of the digestive system is irritating so the cow drinks more water to hurry it's manure along on it's way.The forage and grain is not as completely digested.Because the digestive system contents are acid ,the minerals are less absorbable just as plants can have mineral deficiencies in acid soil.This mineral deficiency makes the cow hungry so it tends to eat more feed(sometimes as much as 40%).
The pathogens that are of concern in dairy products are all both acid tolerant and poor competitors with the beneficial bacteria that we want in our food and in our own digestive systems.The truth of this is obvious.If these acid tolerant bacteria could compete with the common bacteria,they would be everywhere and we would have long ago developed a defense against them.
Safety is the best reason not to feed grain.The cows health and the increase in mineral content of the milk are also benefits.
I suppose,for economic reasons(?) only, a small amount of grain wouldn't hurt.Check the PH of some fresh manure.It shouldn't be below 6.7.You should be able to see the folds from the reticulum and it should have a shiny film coating each section.
the grain nazi
If given the opportunity cattle will indulge on grain and even more so on grain rations that have sweeteners added to them such as molasses and corn syrup. There is usually a considerable amount of sweetener added in order to improve palatability.
Observing what comes out the other end is a good indicator of the quality and amount of feed a cow is receiving. The incidence of mastitis is another, as well as the amount of butterfat in the milk, etc.
Feeding too much grain limits the amount of roughage an animal can consume and since roughage acts as a buffer; its lack thereof acerbates stomach acidity thus affecting the quality of milk by lowering butterfat and protein content among other things. Feed companies and dairy farmers often add buffering agents in an attempt to control the acidity however this is only a band aid treatment in an attempt to compensate for poor feeding practices.
Some farmers treat their cattle like race horses and cattle treated as such will more then likely be fed too much grain along with high protein rations that include the above palatability enhancing ingredients and nutritional supplements.
Some cattle metabolize grain better then others with an efficient increase in milk production. Others on the other hand, even though their milk production may increase will accumulate fat especially in and around their organs thus resulting in numerous health problems and reduced longevity.
As I stated in a previous article, grain is a palatable and nutritious natural food source that can be fed to cattle in moderation along with an adequate supply of roughage. I feed my jerseys what I grow on the farm, oats and maybe a bit of barley for six to seven months of the year. How much and how often I feed is relative to the season and the quality of the pasture or hay.
Steve Smith is correct in pointing out the importance of both consumer and farmer being able to trust each other. A kinship of sorts needs to be established of shared beliefs, mutual support and trust.
Living in a country where the sale of raw milk is illegal I would be very reluctant to sell milk to someone who believed no matter how remote the chance may be that they could be sickened by that product.
Elizabeth, until this disease hypothesis is recognized for what it is (flawed and incomplete) and we abandon this arrogant futile war on organism only then will things begin to improve.
The article below from Mercola’s website entitled “Antibiotic-Resistant Disease Killing Humans and Swine” is worth reading. Unfortunately the article failed to address the implication of using (ARM) antibiotic resistant marker genes in genetic engineered products such as rBST, soil inoculants, corn, soybeans and potatoes, etc.
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2008/04/03/antibiotic-resistant-disease-killing-humans-and-swine.aspx
Ken Conrad
If you see a cow chewing its cud that is a good sign and an indication that she is taking in roughage. The more roughage she takes in the more she chews her cud.
Some farmers acquire free of charge from the bakery bread, buns donuts, tarts, bagels, etc. and feed it to their cattle. This is a big mistake for cattle that are fed such products have a tendency to develop serious digestive problems such as impacted rumens.
Pigs are no different and if you feed them to much of the above as well they to can develop similar problems.
Ken Conrad
There have been numerous incidences of people, motivated by feedlot experiments, purchasing cows and putting them out on pasture alone and expecting them to thrive. This might have worked 100 years ago, but the genetic makeup of many cows today is far removed from that. It's always the cow that suffers for the humans 'ideals'. Being able to read your cow is more prudent. Never can be a dangerous thing.
Absolutes suck…..as does extremism.
Not sure what type of cows Miquel has had, or what kind of pasture they were on, but I really would like to know. Few areas of the world have the capacity to keep up cows on grass 12 months a year. I guess he kept his pasture clipped, for everyone knows the first thing that a cow when let into new pasture is to eat seed heads first (if they are there)….more energy per bite. Handling the mid-summer slump, and the transition to winter forage, would be nice to know too. Snow? It’s not as simple as just growing grass.
The last thing I’d advocate is daily rationing of grain, 365 a year. But if you are truly concerned with your cows, and their condition and health, then concentrates must be considered. I’d be wary of a cow owner that wouldn’t.
The people that make real milk are for the most part doing it for the right reasons. The ‘economic reason’ is not usually high on the priority list.
I have certain cows that need a little extra when the pastures aren’t stoked. And in retrospect I guess these are the ones that I should ‘sell’…and if I viewed these animals as an 'asset' or a 'commodity' I would. It’s different when it’s a family member.
There is much to be said for a more reasonable approach.