Wayne and Kay Craig, and family, at last month’s Weston A. Price Foundation conference. The on-again-off-again enforcement activities by Wisconsin regulators against distributors of raw milk over the last four years have left at least two dairy farmers facing “a Hobson’s choice,” in the words of the Farm-to-Consumer Legal Defense Fund.
The legal defense organization invokes that phrase in a new suit filed in state court against the Wisconsin Department of Agriculture, Trade, and Consumer Protection (DATCP), on behalf of Kay and Wayne Craig, owners of a dairy farm and store in New Holstein, WI.
The suit asks the court to force DATCP to allow the Craigs to distribute raw milk from their store (open only to members of a limited liability company), without need for a retail license. The suit also seeks an injunction against DATCP to prevent it from enforcing its expanding ban on raw milk distribution against the Craigs. A court victory would strike a huge blow against DATCP’s tough campaign launched earlier this year against raw dairy producers in the state, following several years of allowing a few producers permission to distribute, and turning a blind eye to dozens and possibly hundreds of farmers selling raw milk directly to consumers.
According to FTCLDF lawyer, Gary Cox, “The suit seeks declarations that nobody is selling raw milk in violation of the law, and that the LLC store does not need to possess a ‘retail food establishment’ permit in order to operate. “
The FTCLDF essentially argues that the state since 2005 has been entirely inconsistent in its approach to allowing the dairy and store to sell raw milk—first explicitly allowing sales by the Craigs and then this year, reversing itself and refusing to renew the store’s retail licence. Now, in threatening to prohibit raw milk distribution, DATCP gives the Craigs “a Hobson’s choice, i.e., either comply with an unlawful interpretation of a statute or ignore the unlawful interpretation and face the possible consequences of noncompliance.”
Wayne Craig told me in November that he thought he was “next on DATCP’s list” for the lifting of his raw dairy license. This suit most immediately represents an effort to forestall such an effort for the Craigs, but if it’s successful, for possibly hundreds of Wisconsin dairies selling raw milk, now deemed to be in violation of state law.
Among those previously targeted have been Scott Trautman, a dairy farmer, and Max Kane, the owner of a buyers club, who has been ordered to appear in state court on Monday to explain why he shouldn’t divulge his customer list to DATCP. A number of protests are planned that day, including a courthouse rally prior to his appearance before a judge.
***
Separately, oral arguments of the appeal in the case involving Barb and Steve Smith’s Meadowsweet Dairy in upstate New York is due to be heard Jan. 13 before the state’s supreme court Jan. 13. The case has been dragging on for nearly two years.
***
These legal actions follow on the heels of the okay yesterday of raw milk in Framingham, MA, and a rescinding of potentially onerous rules in South Dakota, which I wrote about a few days ago in my posting about John Sheehan’s imaginary job performance review. Suddenly, it seems like lots of action on the raw milk legal and regulatory fronts.
***
A very incisive review of The Raw Milk Revolution (admittedly, I’m biased) from the popular site, Treehugger. But I appreciate it when reviewers are pleasantly surprised, per this comment:
“I entered this book expecting a treatise whose pages would be turned only by a compelling curiosity on the issue of raw milk. Instead, I found 228 pages packed with interesting and personal stories, knit together by an overarching philosophical question: can individual choice survive when the agents of government raise their sights against a minority practicing their beliefs?”
They must survive, if they don’t it would be complete control of the govt; which equates to slavery. Plant the seeds of knowledge and eyes will open along with more voices. When people see that something is going to affect them, they will speak out.
The following is a photo of a kid suffering the effects of a vacc…there are so many like it on the net. Not only kids, adults too. The dancer back east with dystonia, she’ll not dance again…
http://www.naturemoms.com/blog/2009/02/05/motherhood-regrets-and-mistakes/
http://www.rense.com/general88/vacvic.htm
http://juicymaters.com/blog1/?p=369
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/us/17water.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/08/business/energy-environment/08water.html?_r=1&fta=y
http://www.webmd.com/brain/autism/news/20091218/autism-jumps-57percent-in-just-4-years
"Two decades ago we were looking at a prevalence of one in 5,000 children. Now we’re looking at one in 100."
Will they investigate why there is such a drastic increase? Doubtful. Just give the kids more drugs…
After considerable back and forth with the chief counsel for the FDA…I have decided to simply bring an "empty" OPDC RAW MILK container from CA and fill it with Wisconsin raw milk. Makes a better story anyway.
Will someone in Wisconsin please bring some delicious fresh raw milk to me for the Rally. I want to make a toast to our hero Max Kane. It must be a gift or we all go to jail.
Mr. Jim Smith Associate Chief Counsel for the FDA tells our attorney in an Email today that if I bring raw milk from CA and "offer a toast to Max Kane" I will be in violation of CFR 1240.61 and subject to fines and prosecution. In my case $250,000 fine and a possible year in jail. Remember I settled with the FDA on " interstate pet food trafficing". I am such a horrible criminal and bad guy.
Read below…. his exact words copied from the email…:
On 12/18/09 1:17 PM, "Smith, James – OCC" <James.Smith@fda.hhs.gov> wrote:
"No person … shall sell, otherwise distribute, or hold for sale or other distribution after shipment in interstate commerce any milk or milk product in final package form for direct human consumption unless the product has been pasteurized…"
He goes on to say….
Sale is not necessary; any delivery into interstate commerce for human consumption, or distributing after shipment in interstate commerce is prohibited by 21 CFR 1240.61. Leaving aside the TSA issues of carrying 2 gallons of liquid on board a passenger airline, if your client is carrying milk for his own personal consumption, FDA would not have interest in the matter. However, if your client distributed milk he brought from California to other people in Wisconsin (or any other location outside California) for their consumption, including "toasting" Mr. Kane, such distribution would violate the prohibition set forth in 21 CFR 1240.61.
Jim Smith, Associate Chief Counsel
US Food and Drug Administration
5600 Fishers Lane
Room 6-57
Rockville, MD 20857
office: 301.827.6917
cell: 202.510.4283
fax: 301.443.0739
james.smith@fda.hhs.gov
These are my words….
Those are his exact words. Maybe you should give him a piece of your mind….his email is right here. May I suggest that the piece of your mind include a well written testimony about how raw milk has dramatically improved your personal health. Be respectfull or he will not read it at all.
We must all understand that we must reach out to educate the FDA ( and others ) as best we can. They have families and many have IBS and Asthma, autism etc…. They are suffering the terrible effects of bone loss from cortico steroids and drug side effects just like so many other Americans that do not seek out and use whole food nutrition and raw milk to stay robustly healthy.
When in Wisconsin we need to realize that there will be plenty of FDA special agents standing among us. Our respectful education of them will be critical to the advancement of this universal human cause. Lets do everything we can to tell our stories of healing and reach out to them even though it may hurt. Turn the other cheek.
Max Kane has championed a cause and stood up as a pioneering man with dignity, passion and dedication. It is time to stand with him at his Wounded Gut. His life was saved by raw milk after his Crohns diagnosis. Other Americans need to know this. This is the highest and best use of the 1st Amendment. Do not let the FDA rob your 1st Amendment rights. If you do not use them you will lose them. 1st Amendment rights must be exercised or lost.
See you next Monday. Snow rain or shine.
Do not forget to bring some free raw milk for me. I want to hold up a toast to Max Kane and all the farmers and consumers that have reconnected to make America a better place from the raw grass roots up. The FDA dares not stand against the people at least in public.
They hate bad press.
This is a time to shine and educate. No bashing pastuerized milk. This is a time to be relevent, science based and educate others. This is a time to be Americans and fight to make things right. This is a time to rebel in masse. But do it peacefully and hugely. Bring your raw milk for a huge Max Kane toast. This is a photo op and we need to make this front page news everywhere.
How about hundreds of people raising up a glass or cup or half gallon or what ever they have holding raw milk….that is the story. The FDA nor can anyone else can stop us all from consuming our raw milk….we are Americans lets act like it and rise up…in this case our cups of raw milk.
Bring your video cameras….and your raw milk shirts and hats and raw milk containers.
We will know the FDA speical agents…they will be the ones that do not toast. Make sure you bring enough for them as well. everyone bring extra cups and share with your neigbors. The FDA special agents will need to toast with us or stand out like a sore thumb!! if they identify themselves…in this way, spend some extra special time educating them. Especially the moms and the doctors among us. Maybe they to will fall in love with raw milk and not experience lactose intolerance. Perhaps then they will question Sheehan and his strangely blind, biased, bent directives against raw milk.
How can a US state line change safety or rights. This is idiocy!!!! It does not!!!
This is unAmerican and a worthy fight. It is a fight against the Autism, diabetes, asthma, IBS and immune depression growth curves.
Mark McAfee
Love your spark, but a sledge hammer is perhaps the wrong tool in this issue? It’s neve rblack and white – except when it comes to our rights.
We do need standards for production – the issue is WHO gets to define the standards, and the budget of gov’t to regulate those standards. Citizens have the power to define their tax dollars; Citizens can control the budget. Can farmers self-regulate?
Love,
-Blair
Sure I would love to be nuanced. Who should I nuance. The guy that wants to put me into jail for feeding people.
The FDA refuses to meet, talk, recieve data or studies or do anything. It is a nutritional medical military blockade.
When the FDA changed the standards on Colostrum two years ago and mandated that all colostrum be pastuerized, that was done behind closed doors…..administratively. The FDA does not use Nuance. When I attended NCIMS last year to fight for peoples rights to access and drink raw milk, I used Nuance and was very polite and proper and professional. That got us little….except for a little press. They used a hammer on me and raw milk. I get hammered and I am supposed to be nuanced???
This is a fight….The only thing that the FDA undertstands is extreme pain applied by a mass up rising of people consuming raw milk with media support. This is the best advice I have ever heard. It works and it is proven in history. How and when that extreme pain is applied is nuance. Now is the time and Wisconsin is the place and we are the people to do it.
Love to you as well,
Mark
One more thing. It has now been identified that the FDA gets its mail right here at TCP.
What ever you say is digested and archived as a message to the bowel of the beast.
This is the court of public opinion. Do not bow to the FDA ever…
Yes farmers can self regulate. They do it very effectively in Colorado. Does a retail approved raw dairy product need regulation…yes probably.
I is like the FAA….ultralites get very little regulation….small private planes get a few more regs…and big public planes with 300 passengers that do not know or see their pilots need tons more regs.
But that is logic…the FDA does not use logic. It is a political machine with dogma following soldiers in "military uniforms" controlling our food for the benefit of corporations and drug companies and with out our input or transparency.
Nuance…..nuance is a hammer placed just in the right place, at the right time by the right people for the right purpose. Thats nuance.
Mark
Sometimes you listen to someone pontificate, bluster, and, ultimately, let others take the risks, usually in the tone, "Yeah, I’m behind you…WAAAAYYY behind you where it’s safe…but I’m behind you."
Get ’em Max…I wish I could be there with you.
MM…just git.
Blaire…was that nuanced, or subtle, enough?
Bob Hayles
http://www.juicymaters.com
EVERY time you contact an elected official, remind them, "We don’t work for you. You work for us."
Scott Trautman here — fellow criminal raw milker, widow and orphan poisoner.
"Nuanced". Ha! An Evangelist does not know what that word means.
I heard the word ‘evangelist’ from Joel Salatin at the Grazing conference, Feb 2007. And as soon as he said that word — that this is what he was — I knew I was too.
My GOD, THINK of all the fantastic speakers – the Brave – the Proud.
We are on the edge of one major paradigm shift. People in charge of their health – instead of beholden to it. Some big big interests see some changing thinking – and we can’t have that, things are going so awful darn well as it is….for them…
Come honor farmers everywhere! The battle is at Raw Milk now — but the rest of you watch out – they are coming for you next.
Max Kane, Hero! I should be so brave.
MONDAY Dec 21-
I already warned David, I’m a hugger. May I declare a "It’s okay for men to hug and to cry day" Monday. I know I’ve done a lot of both — as we grow closer — what an honor to be around such incredible people. I don’t care who sees it, knows it. Tears of joy, tears of sorrow: emotional honesty. Turning point in my life Monday, for sure.
BE SURE and see Max’s video, just posted on Youtube. Fantastic!
PROUD dairyman from Wisconsin – Scott Trautman
See ya at the rally! Let’s toast some milk! My treat!
Someone pass along my tag line to that POS food regulator…"We don’t work for you. You work for US."
Bob Hayles
Perhaps the most damning part was when this Public Servant refused to state that he had sworn to uphold the Constitution nor would he admit that he even read his states Constitution. About a year ago I asked a commenter on this blog that appears to be a Public Servant if she/he had sworn to uphold the US Constitution as I have done but there was no answer forth coming. WHY what do they fear about it? Its only a _____ piece of paper a former high office holder was reported to have said. Do these folks [Public Servants] love and support the US Constitution and their state Constution or is that maybe an impediment to a possible unlawful agenda?
"Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms [of government] those entrusted with power have in time and by SLOW OPERATIONS perverted it into tyranny." Thomas Jefferson Where are we today in Jeffersons time line?
"No, I don’t have a permit. Bessy just needed milking…"
At the same time, it will be symbolic to watch Mark toast with someone else’s milk in an OPDC bottle.
Amanda
The words spoken here are truely American. The actions on Monday are even more so.
Bring your raw milk and lets toast from coast to coast for Max…he is us. He is the action against the medical nutritional destruction machine. The action against the autism, diabetes, IBS and Asthma growth curves.
I am so proud of all of you. This is our time.
Mark
"One must realize what is going on and WAKE up to the FACT the American people are under attack. Not just by terrorist but by traitors and the very food INDUSTRY that we depend on for our food and SURVIVAL. We are being sold out." Rob Taylor
Very scary strong words from this writer is he correct or not?
Then if I bleed or fail,
Or strongly win what matters it?
God only doth prevail,
The servant craveth naught
Except to serve with might,
I was not told to win or lose-
My orders are to fight.
-Ethelwyn Wetherald
See you at the rally!
We are headed that way. The only question is have the events of the last year awakened us enough to get us going toward recovering the country the founding fathers intended it to be?
Bob Hayles
http://www.juicymaters.com
Remind every elected official you contact, "We don’t work for you. You work for US."
Last year the average American used $6700 worth of medication.
In 2005, 81% of Americans took one medication per week and 27% of Americans took at least five medications per week. ( Sloan survey 2005 )
$28 bilion dollars of worth of Statin drugs were despensed and used in America last year.
The medical basis is discussed by the British Medical Journal ( June 2009 )for the rational use of Statins and states that there is a mortality improvement of .6% for those taking statins ( a reduction from 5.7% to 5.1% in the control group ).
The HALE study measured the improvement in mortality when people exercized ( had a healthy lifestyle ) and ate a mediterranean diet with whole foods. The mortality improvement was 50%.
Um….lets see…..point six percent ( thats .6 % ) thats about half of one percent drop in mortality for using $28 billion dollars of statins.
Oh…also add that statins also caused dramatic side effects including poor brain function, muscle use issues and neuropathies, and liver enzyme defects.
50% verse ..6%. …..if this does not start your engine….nothing will…you are brain dead and perhaps taking statins.
Some one at the FDA can not do math and some one at the FDA is taking payoffs.
The problem with all of this is this….we can not speak the medical truth of whole food for fear of the FDA jailing us. Our rights to speak out against drugs and speak in support of whole foods is the issue. Regulations have gone silly stupid and must be changed immediately.
We can not speak one word of medical truth in the same breath as a whole food. This is the problem. We must have the USDA seize regulatory control of the food we eat from the FDA. Food is not a drug and the FDA should not be anywhere near our food.
A Mediterranean whole food diet verses $28 billion dollars spent on statins!!!!!!??????
The Direct Farmer to Consumer reconnection is the National Health Care Plan and the National Economic Stimulous plan all in one zero cost raw grass roots package…..
See you on the court house steps….. please bring some raw milk.
Mark
Amanda, do you allude to outsourcing and using milk destined for pasteurization? As they say at USDA, "Know Your Farmer, Know Your Food." In general, that agency doesn’t care where the food comes from, so long as the burger (or whatever else they regulate) makes money.
The USDA doesn’t regulate milk. Don’t you know that?
Mark here is an article thats "food" for thought you may want to reconsider what you said.
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/health/food/news.php?q=1261244069
2010 FOOD CRISIS FOR DUMMIES by Eric Carbonnel
USDA [harvest] ESTIMATES MAKE NO SENSE
What will next year bring? Food shortages? Monetary default? How many banks failed in 2009?
I now have to go shovel about 18 inches of snow from my sidewalk that the GLOBALWARMERS dumped on us overnight our local Public Servants give us 24 hours before they issue fines as they did to an 80 years old woman a few years ago I think it was 300 FRN’s then. And all for the collective public good of course.
Mark…close, but not quite. The problem is people who talk a good game, but won’t walk the walk.
Max Kane may go to jail tomorrow for his beliefs. People here in Georgia are planning to openly defy the state department of agriculture and FDA and risk jail doing so.
Truly small dairy farmers all over the country risk jail and financial ruin to stand up for their beliefs…they don’t fear jail, they know the truth in the saying, "When a people fear the government, it is tyranny. When the government fears it’s people it is liberty."
Folks all over the country defy the government demanding the right to make their own nutritional choices rather than fearing jail.
Some folks fly across the country with empty plastic jugs to garner a bit of publicity without risking anything, because they fear government. For all your bluster, that is you.
You are enslaved as much as Lykke. At least Lykke knows and accepts it.
How are those chains feeling, Mark?
Bob Hayles
http://www.juicymaters.com
Remember, tell EVERY elected official you come in contact with, "We don’t work for you. You work for us."
I also think Mark is sometimes too big for his britches, but I believe his commitment to freedom of choice is real. Also, he does not attack small farmers disingenuously, as Lykke does, unless she is really as ignorant as she seems.
Since he is a "big" player in the raw milk/free choice arena, Mark has had to accept the slings and arrows of a flawed legal system – one in which you are apparently guilty until proven innocent, unless you want to spend an outrageous amount in legal fees defending yourself. And one in which you can abrogate your responsibility as a parent, while the truth about the risks was there all along.
You have obviously come through some hard times and are now making up for some lost time, using good fortune and a good brain. Please be forgiving of other people who are trying to make it to the same place you are lucky to be in, but are approaching it from a slightly different position.
Are you paid to post your propaganda on this board? David is welcome to block me from posting. Actually, I would simply stop if he asked.
Kristen,
It was Mark who started the discussion about USDA regulating milk instead of FDA. It is a good question since in most states milk is regulated by agriculture departments, not public health.
Bob,
Yes, I wear my chains with pride. Believe it or not, the majority of people I come across outside this blog are grateful for the food and water protection regulations, and many say we need even stricter rules. I think this group is in the minority saying that food protection is unconstitutional. And I don’t think comments like this one from milk farmer last post generate much sympathy for raw milk rights "[raw milk]…marginalized and rejected off hand because of some sick kid….." Some sick kid? Anyone producing food with that attitude should be marginalized. It seems from your posts that you don’t share that viewpoint and would care if someone became ill, and want to find and fix the problem.
I’m about half-way through David’s book. It is very different from the Schmid raw milk book. There’s some factual problems in places , but it tells an interesting and relevant story about the debate. IMHO, if he had kicked me, cp, Mary McGonigle-Martin, Regulator, and others that aren’t in line with the raw milk movement off this board (and removed all references to us in the book), it would have been one dull read.
How is it any different that the govt/pharm companies stating it is worth the risks even when it harms/kills one child/person? Please explain this. Where has the govt or any other entity "fixed" the problem? They’ve shown they don’t give a damn about people.
"How is it any different that the govt/pharm companies stating it is worth the risks even when it harms/kills one child/person?"
It isn’t any different. There are good and bad attitudes across all areas of food/pharma. I do have a hard time seeing why Max Kane would be put in jail (if that happens), when Stuart Parnell of PCA infamy was not.
Your other question is offensive and I’m not going to respond to it.
Pretty typical…taking a quote out of context to bolster your warped view of rights, and try to cast the good folk as bad.
if you take the whole sentence it makes more sense….here it is
"yet in the raw milk debate….the proof…the tens of thousand of testimonials from people where raw milk is making a difference is totally disregarded, marginalized and rejected off hand because of some sick kid…..and the ambulance chasers have an open season."
Fact is again you concentrate on the worst case scenario, and totally ignore all the good. You put the blinder of ‘peer review’ on and ignore the tremendous good that raw milk is doing…and try to cast those who promote it as careless, unfeeling, greedy individuals. Your act is getting tiresome, and it’s obvious that you can’t see the trees for the forest….weep, wail,weep
The difference between the vaccine makers and the raw milk farmers is that the risks with vaccines are accepted (although every effort is made to hide them from the public)….and the drugs are promoted….and the drug makers make incredible profits while being shielded from retribution from those they injure. If the drug companies were treated like raw milk farmers, they wouldn’t have the guts to ‘stay in the game’….because most fresh milk producers are not in it for the money…they are doing it for the right reasons.
I drink from EVERY batch of milk I create, and so does my wife and child. I have a number of kids that have drank my milk since they were in utero….and dozens more that have a better chance for a healthy adulthood because their parents recognize the fallacy that the FDA the USDA and the other dietary dictocrats promote. I take what I do very seriously…and recognize that the health and life of everyone of my customers, and me and my family, is in the balance when I wipe those teats, wash the bucket or fill the jug. I resent your position…and your insinuations. Someone needs to give YOU an attitude change….
you’ve got big balls to talk about offensiveness.
Even with the whole sentence (context), I still think the part about "some sick kid" implies a lack of caring. However, maybe that was written during a moment of frustration, and your clarification stands – that you take what you do very seriously (quality and safety). If I’ve ever implied that all raw dairy producers are lumped into one bad category, then I apologize. I’d actually prefer to focus on those that have no problems, and figure out the best approach to balance food rights and food safety with respect to raw milk. But, the "public image" of this movement is overrun with misinformation about the statistics, biology and immunology. Amanda Rose brought up a good point here concerning the issue of informed choice…something along the lines that if the consumer is given misinformation, then its not truly informed choice (paraphrasing).
"you’ve got big balls to talk about offensiveness."
🙂
beware in wisconson for this individual, it is possible they will be there.
lykke is of this sort, s/he probably works for the fda and is here on assignment to disrupt. anyone who wants to offer an alternative reason for her presence please feel free to offer it. anyone who thinks lykke is fair and balanced please pipe in.
lykke doesn’t answer direct questions when the truthful answer is pro-american spirit and american liberty. s/he can’t it goes against her reason for being here.
the more s/he says the more broken record it sounds.
it’s ashamed there are such puppets available for the government to manipulate and use like this but there are many. s/he not alone. but like all the rest when they are done with her she’ll be cut loose and hung out to dry.
she can’t be trusted to tell the truth she’s paid to spout dogma. her last post (above) where s/he says " I’d actually prefer to focus on those that have no problems, and figure out the best approach to balance food rights and food safety with respect to raw milk." —- is a lie. s/he has no interest in figuring out anything except how to stomp out the supply demand factors that have real milk on the radar of many who wish to excape the SAD.
i think lykke that you’re a sad excuse for a government employee and i do not wish you anything you don’t deserve in life. you reep what you sow.
I’m in a van with Michael Schmidt, Mark McAfee, and Kathy Pirdle on our way from Chicago to Viroqua, WI, and we decided that if agents show themselves and try to make trouble, we’ll just toast them with raw milk. Seriously, we don’t expect any problems. Just a bunch of citizens expressing their right to peaceably assemble. Max Kane thinks there could be hundreds of people there. Hard to know. His video a big hit–1,500 views in its first 36 hours.
If you’re around Viroqua tomorrow, stop in. More news then.
David
You’re paranoid and off base.
Me? No, no one pays me to comment here. But I asked about you and you dodged the question. I’ve answered your question to me now lets hear your answer! Are you paid to post here?
I never said paid shills weren’t welcome. However it would be good if they were honest enough to admit to what they are about.
Pete
No, I’m not paid to post here. And have never met anyone paid to post on blogs. Do you know the name of a contact who would pay me for my personal opinions and commentary…I could use the extra money, especially after the holidays?
I’m trying to figure out what pissed you off so much. This quote?
"I’d actually prefer to focus on those that have no problems, and figure out the best approach to balance food rights and food safety with respect to raw milk."
That probably made FDA mad too.
You are both losers and deserve each other.
By "nuanced" I mean the fight we are fighting includes several different perspectives, and I’m asking you to include the 2-cow dairy and the 4-goat dairy from Colorado or Vermont….
Please Consider the possibility that some health dept’s might work with us if they didn’t think we wanted to castrate them at first encounter.
We have not been subject to the same harassment as you; we do have a respectful dept of health in CO – they may not like raw milk but they do respect the law. I still believe they would sit at the table with us if they didn’t read your fightin words so often….There are decent people who want to help farmers – in some states.
I was out of context in this current discussion. I’m just saying that there are
fragile relationships being formed, and your sledge-hammer does not apply to all states, nor all dairies. I want want you to remember that some of us would like the chance to have a dialogue with our local regulators, without you acting as our spokesperson.
Because one size does not fit all.
Still despise the FDA, but not CO regulators. I want the opportunity to talk to them without pre-conceived hatred.
-Blair
http://www.lacrossetribune.com/news/local/article_2549b3be-ed1a-11de-82c9-001cc4c03286.html
"Max Kane Farley BELIEVES unpasturize milk saved his life"
I as well Believe that at 68 years old raw dairy saved my life am now a healthy at 73 1/2.
It would appear since Max and I Believe the same doctrine we must belong to ths same church. Could we call it the church of raw dairy and the fruits of obeying the laws of this church are the heeling of our bodies and to be free of chronic illness.
But of course along came the enemy and said you fools you can’t believe that nonsense you must join the the church of the corporation or else! we know whats good for you we are in-fail-able . Our costly witches brews are the essence of your [shortened] life. Bow before the church of the corporation and our scientiic high priests and believe our skewed data give us your money and you shall be saved.
Who does one BELIEVE? I believe what my body was telling me for 68 years by consuming the SAD I suffered years of needless pain. I also today believe what my body is telling me for yesterday I shoveled snow for 3 hours only a few slight aches now.
I do hope the church of the corporation will "allow" me in these my final days to indulge myself by enjoying my morning 3/4 cup of raw cream, scoops of raw butter and all their other no nos. Since I don’t consume any of the church of the corporations witch’s brews and they are losing money called FRN,s I would assume they are angry with me and all the rest of us that they consider as fools.
To believe or not to believe that is the question. You all know exactly where I stand and you all know my real name. I think that takes a bit of guts these days to let it all hang out and not stand hiding behind the curtain as many do. Its called transparency and is not a word that TPTB love or practise.
http://newsofthenorth.net/article/Government/State_and_national/Holy_cash_cow_US_pays_Wisconsin_dairy_farmers_57_million_in_aid/31249
Many on this blog along with Amanda have referred to truthful information from all sides, to make informed choices. It has been said repeatedly here for years.
Lykke-If I’ve ever implied that all raw dairy producers are lumped into one bad category,"
You have numerous times.
Lykke- I’d actually prefer to focus on those that have no problems, and figure out the best approach to balance food rights and food safety with respect to raw milk."
You’ve not shown this to be true on this blog.
Lykke-But, the "public image" of this movement is overrun with misinformation about the statistics, biology and immunology."
LMAO This can be said in regards to the govt along with big business.
Lykke-That probably made FDA mad too.
You are both losers and deserve each other. "
Are you saying the fda is a loser? If so, I agree.
Your previous post is disingenuous and you are a liar. It’s obvious a tact that you like to use is to throw out statements to make yourself seem reasonable, when in fact they are outright lies. You are a low-life, and deserve a bitch slap.
That you feign sorrow for being misinterpreted is a joke. You have repeatedly lumped raw dairy producers into one bad category….and your apology is not accepted. You must really think that we a fools for you to write such insincere words as these.
You have never ‘focused’ on those that that produce ‘problem free’, and your idea of ‘balance’ would eliminate food choice. Again, you must really not give us much credit when you wrote these words….because after months of reading your fear mongering, governmental agency supporting, laboratory spawned probiotic, what about the kids drivel, you have chutzbah to think that we’d believe this.
The public image of this movement is up for interpretation. I can imagine if need be, that we could get tens of thousands….or more….to testify to the difference that raw milk is making in their quality of life. Sure you can bash Mark (sometimes he does make it easy), and yes you can call the Foundation to task for not being ‘objective’….but the fact is, and it can’t be changed with any lab test, peer reviewed article, or anything else that you and your scumbag cronies can come up with, that raw milk when taken as a whole is far more beneficial than detrimental…
Consumers are in a quandry here….should they believe the ‘misinformation’ from the governmental agencies that are supposed to serve them…or should they believe the ‘misinformation’ that a advocacy group has done so well to get out.
The more you write, the less respect you are garnering here.
Blair- while I can understand your position regarding the regulators in your state….that they can’t understand the feelings toward the non-compassionate, closed, lets persecute the small farmer regulators in other states, can be quite telling. Quite often, those that are faking reasonableness will latch onto anything to cross you, while still maintaining their I really want to help you, but grin. If they are truly open, than comments on a blog won’t change that…and if they aren’t, they’ll look for any excuse not to work with you….
And on this most significant day, where Mother Earth draws in to the fullest extent of her breath, I wish you all (even those with fear and hate in their hearts) a Happy Solstice. Remember, The Sun is the original reason for the season……
"I’d actually prefer to focus on those that have no problems, and figure out the best approach to balance food rights and food safety with respect to raw milk."
Now we just have the problem of Lykke apparently thinking that regulation enacted by folks like the FDA, USDA, et al, supersedes the constitution. Sadly, Lykke will probably not be able to grasp that this is a nation of laws, and that the constitution is supreme in our laws. Lykke would prefer the country being run according to that document to be a matter of convenience, instead preferring the security of the nanny state.
Lykke, you say you wear the nanny state chains proudly…do you know the entire quote that is taken from, and who said it? Let me help you out here:
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.Samuel Adams
Lykke, when it comes to people like you, who love the security of the nanny state so much, I get especially fond of the last sentence in that quote…especially since so many suffered and died for those rights you dismiss so easily.
Bob Hayles
http://www.juicymaters.com
Remember, EVERY time you are in contact with an elected official, remind them, "We don’t work for you. You work for US."
"He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he [she] whose mind is filled with falsehood and errors" Thomas Jefferson A very very old book warns us not to believe a lie nor practise falsehood but of course thats just a LOL these days. Also it is not the small raw milk farmers that are flushing our nation down the tube but what the ENABLERS don’t understand is that they are also being flush down the tube with us all. And they do not understand the peril even they face.
America’s greatest danger is our utter BLINDNESS. It can’t happen to us we are special. But history says otherwise and sadly most American’s deserve an F grade in world history and the history of 1776 do we not? Has George 3rd migrated to our shores with his red coats dressed in suits?
Free speech is wonderful but how much longer shall we enjoy it?
For as long as we draw breath if we choose to. The real question is, will we so choose?
"It is the first responsibility of every citzen to question authority" Benjamin Franklin
http://twitter.com/#search?q=%23rallymax
Or follow David’s tweets @davidgumpert
You can come to my small farm and and bitch slap me. My animals and I will give you a hug. Happy Winter Solstice to one and all!
"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law…Love is the law, love under will."
Aleister Crowley